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Got the snot shocked outta me today


Cliff

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And learned sumpin.

When you are going to go in an existing conduit box don't just throw the appropriate breaker.

CHECK THE NEUTRAL AND GROUND with a tester.  Check em all.

I got a slick little circuit breaker finder.  Used it to find the breaker.   Threw it to off. opened the box  checked the neutral and hot lines and got no energy.

Then as I was working my hand brushed the neutral and  up against the  metal box.  OUCH~!!!!

So in bafflement I tested that and lo there was 125 VAC between the neutral and the ground.

 

I found that breaker that energized that neutral and tossed it to off.

IT seems to energize nothing else in the building so it's locked out till an electrician can look at it.

 

Edited by Ron Dudelston
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2 hours ago, lew said:

floating ground

The building is over 250 years old.  The ground is a roaring joke.  A little cable that disappears into the gravel in the little alcove in the cellar where my  water system is.

 

I recently replaced the  water and electric line from the well to the house. The old one is copper. Now that it's cut off I plan to braise a connection to that  old copper pipe and reinforce the ground.

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I feel your pain Cliff.  Back in 2003, we were building a 20,000 sq. ft. addition on the church and were doing much of the work ourselves.  There were four of us working under another's electrical license which was all legal. I thought all of us knew what we were doing but one of us (an electrical engineer) wired a receptacle backwards.  That is, wired the neutral to the hot side and the hot side to the neutral and it was the last receptacle on the run.  Of course, it made the neutral hot for that circuit and as luck would have it, I was the next guy in line.  I randomly grabbed a hold of the neutral while working in a 12 x 12 junction box and it lit me up.  We had words with the said "electrical engineer".

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I had a Georgia Tech Grad, with an EE degree working for me, and he couldn't even troubleshoot a simple circuit for me on an accident investigation. I had to take him by the hand and teach him simple electrical principles.

 

I guess it's the same old story...what do you call the guy who graduated last in his class at medical school...DOCTOR!

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  • 2 months later...

Just glad the shock was your hand, and didn’t go through your chest/heart area. Not to be the newcomer here giving advice, but if you get a shock through the chest, your heart can go into (I’ll probably get the medical terms wrong) fibrillation. You can think you’re ok because you’re walkin and talkin, but die from it two days later. An electrician friend of mine got a shock like that, felt crappy, went home at end of day, and complained to his wife.She drove him (against his will) to the emergency room, and they had to use the paddles on him to get his heart’s rythym back in order. I did some of my apprentice time with an old timer that would check voltages up to 240 volts with his two fingers. Now I was stupid enough to try that once, and happy to leave it at that.

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Just because he was an "old timer" doesn't mean that he was smart...just real lucky. The first time I arced a 220V outlet at 14 because I threw the wrong breaker off, I learned to ALWAYS check before sticking my fingers into the wires.

 

Oh the stories I could tell about electrical misadventures would take hours.

 

 

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Doing a demo for a factory remodel....new everything inside the office.    Sparky cut the 270V light free from the conduit.....never switched the breaker off...happened to brush against one of the conduits....and got a burn mark on my arm.....needless to say....."SPARKY!!!!"   he didn't believe anyone, until he touched the tube....about knocked him on his rearend...THEN he went and popped the breakers...all of them...

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Guess I'm really lucky. When I was an apprentice welder, I was welding test plates in the welding booth . I had hung the tongs on a hanger with a welding rod still in it, so that I could take the hot test plate and dip it into some water for cooling. When I stood up, I brushed my head against the welding rod, with my hands and wet gloves on the metal  grounding table. . I couldn't move. It felt like someone had wrapped their arms around me and was squeezing as tight as possible. Suddenly, it was gone. A friend saw what was happening and quickly pulled the welding rod away. I think I'd be ashes today if he hadn't seen what happened. I learned a lot that day.

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I know this is really late, but........................................ It isn't uncommon to have the situation Cliff described in either residential or commercial wiring. In the familiar 120/240v setup that most homes and many small commercial buildings have, there are two legs, each at 120 volts, that are exactly opposite in phase. Line-to-line voltage will be approximately 240 volts, and either line-to-neutral(or ground) will be about 120 volts. The neutral will carry the unbalanced current from two opposing 120v legs back to the source, in a multiwire branch circuit.

 

Electrical professionals should understand this, but it's not intuitive to the untrained person. This is why the NEC was changed a few years back to require that all legs of a multiwire branch circuit(one with a shared neutral) open simultaneously. As is usually the case, existing circuitry was not required to be changed. Of course, many residences suffer from uninspected "bootleg" electrical installations, as well, but that's a whole 'nother can of worms.

 

There is also a three-phase flavor of MWBC's, but very few of them apply to residential occupancies.

 

I hope this helps a little.

 

Dave

 

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From the voice of experience - those are ok, but can (may be notorious for) giving a false positive reading.  My BIL & I chased a false positive for nearly two hours this past summer before locating the source - a live extension cord about 5 feet away!  I use it all the time and feel pretty confidant when it shows no juice though.

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1 hour ago, Cal said:

From the voice of experience - those are ok, but can (may be notorious for) giving a false positive reading.  My BIL & I chased a false positive for nearly two hours this past summer before locating the source - a live extension cord about 5 feet away!  I use it all the time and feel pretty confidant when it shows no juice though.

 Test it on a known live source before and after you test the circuit your working on.   That way you know it is working.  Roly

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