Popular Post Ron Altier Posted October 15, 2018 Popular Post Report Share Posted October 15, 2018 I think this would take some experience and skill to make this joint fit right and tight. It tightens as it is tapped in. The wedge would have to be the exact length and width needed. HARO50, Dadio, DuckSoup and 5 others 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stick486 Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 that is quite easy to make... by the 2nd try you'll have it down to a science.. Ron Altier, Gene Howe and John Morris 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkeye10 Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 Ron, do you think chopping out the mortise would be best? I think it would be a good joint for bigger timbers, but for everyday joints not so much. One of the bigger problems is figuring out the dimensions on the wedges. They would have to be perfect. We will let Stick do that. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stick486 Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 (edited) cut a conventional mortise and fitted tenon but a tad short... slot the tenon.. slope the mortise 2~3° as shown.. draw out the mortise.. lay the tenon on the drawing... experiment w/ the wedge tapers and thicknesses... remember.. you are going for good and snug, not tight... tip... drill a hole where the slot ends near the tenon's shoulder.. make the hole about twice the dia as the slot is wide to help control unwanted splitting... make your wedges single taper w/ the flats to the center and the tapers to the outside... Edited October 16, 2018 by Stick486 hawkeye10, Dadio, HARO50 and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 40 minutes ago, Stick486 said: tip... drill a hole where the slot nears the tenon's shoulder about twice the dia as the slot is wide to control unwanted splitting... I did not understand this part. It may just be me operating in some sort of fog this morning though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post John Morris Posted October 16, 2018 Popular Post Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 12 minutes ago, Cal said: I did not understand this part. It may just be me operating in some sort of fog this morning though. If you drill a small hole at the base of the tenon it will not split through as the wedges are driven home. Probably not necessary on this specific tenon because there is a lot of meat there, but's really handy with smaller delicate tenons and relatively larger wedges. The hole relieves the stress as the wedges drive the split tenons apart, theoretically the hole will stop it from splitting through to the exposed piece. Think of it like saw cutting lines into concrete slabs, if the slab starts stress cracking, theoretically the stress cracks should stop at the saw cut line. If the wood wants to split beyond the shoulder of the tenon, the hole should stop it from going beyond the shoulder. Stick486, HARO50, Cal and 2 others 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stick486 Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, John Morris said: If you drill a small hole at the base of the tenon it will not split through as the wedges are driven home. Probably not necessary on this specific tenon because there is a lot of meat there, but's really handy with smaller delicate tenons and relatively larger wedges. The hole relieves the stress as the wedges drive the split tenons apart, theoretically the hole will stop it from splitting through to the exposed piece. Think of it like saw cutting lines into concrete slabs, if the slab starts stress cracking, theoretically the stress cracks should stop at the saw cut line. If the wood wants to split beyond the shoulder of the tenon, the hole should stop it from going beyond the shoulder. that's the ticket... Cal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 I think I got it now, thanks for the explanation John. Stick486 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stick486 Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 Just now, Cal said: I think I got it now, thanks for the explanation John. I edited for better clarity (I hope)... might want to have a look/see/read... Cal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 Check! Stick486 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 not difficult at all but please DO NOT bring the piece to me for repairs some 20 years later when the glue fails. You wouldn't want to take have to that joint apart. There is no non destructive way to do it. HARO50, Cal and John Morris 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAB Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 it's called a "stop drill", much used in metal working. stops cracking and eliminates a stress riser. John Morris and Cal 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Morris Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 35 minutes ago, Cliff said: not difficult at all but please DO NOT bring the piece to me for repairs some 20 years later when the glue fails. You wouldn't want to take have to that joint apart. There is no non destructive way to do it. Excellent point Cliff!!!!!! Cal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Howe Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 Yeah, there's no easy way to deconstruct that joint. But then, that's the whole idea, no? I used that process to fasten the side stretchers of my Morris chairs to the back legs. The fronts were through mortises. Cal and HARO50 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAB Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 "well, ma'am, sorry to hear about your broken table, but with the joinery, there is no way i can fix this and hide my work. you should consider buying a new table, that i'll make for you. it'll be really nice." HARO50 and Cal 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatuffej Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 I don't see the point of such complexity in M/T joinery. If the mortise and tenon are sized properly for project and machined to fit snugly, then when glued and clamped, they should never come apart, yes? hat Ron Altier and Cal 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stick486 Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 37 minutes ago, hatuffej said: they should never come apart, yes? no.. but that one won't... Cal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkeye10 Posted October 17, 2018 Report Share Posted October 17, 2018 14 hours ago, Stick486 said: cut a conventional mortise and fitted tenon but a tad short... slot the tenon.. slope the mortise 2~3° as shown.. draw out the mortise.. lay the tenon on the drawing... experiment w/ the wedge tapers and thicknesses... remember.. you are going for good and snug, not tight... tip... drill a hole where the slot ends near the tenon's shoulder.. make the hole about twice the dia as the slot is wide to help control unwanted splitting... make your wedges single taper w/ the flats to the center and the tapers to the outside... "cut a conventional mortise and fitted tenon but a tad short..." Stick, are you saying don't taper the sides of the mortise? In the picture, it shows layout lines for the mortise and they look tapered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Altier Posted October 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2018 I think the origins of this joint are very old and use horse hide glue. Very clever and very dependable. A very simple and strong joint. Research called the "Snork" joint. HARO50 and Cal 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stick486 Posted October 17, 2018 Report Share Posted October 17, 2018 1 hour ago, hawkeye10 said: Stick, are you saying don't taper the sides of the mortise? In the picture, it shows layout lines for the mortise and they look tapered. I'm saying ''DO'' taper the sides... 15 hours ago, Stick486 said: slope the mortise 2~3° as shown.. Cal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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