Dust collectors won't pick up if the small ports not enough vacumn. Now a shop vac will. It's like this on small power tools like the Domino ,biscuit jointer but the Delta ras has I believe a 2" port were the powermatic band saw has a 3"...

 

5 hours ago, BillyJack said:

Dust collectors won't pick up if the small ports not enough vacumn. Now a shop vac will. It's like this on small power tools like the Domino ,biscuit jointer but the Delta ras has I believe a 2" port were the powermatic band saw has a 3"...

 

I use my DC on my PC sander and on my Rigid oscillating sander and they collect fine. I agree not the best use of a dc but much less noisy.

The ceiling run will probable be some where around 25-30 ft of ridged pvc or approx. 15 or so ft of flex along the floor.  

Another question I have a oneida cyclone 4 in. kit that comes with the 15 gallon barrel. The base of the cyclone is like 16 in. diameter and kinda has a flair to it. I am thinking that I want a larger barrel.

Would it be an issue if there is actually a small lip under the edge of the cyclone. I understand that this lip might catch some of the chips but will it affect the function.

Attached is the onieda cyclone kit Ihave and the 55 gallon blue barrel I want to use. 

 

4 minutes ago, Larry Blighton said:

The ceiling run will probable be some where around 25-30 ft of ridged pvc or approx. 15 or so ft of flex along the floor.  

Another question I have a oneida cyclone 4 in. kit that comes with the 15 gallon barrel. The base of the cyclone is like 16 in. diameter and kinda has a flair to it. I am thinking that I want a larger barrel.

Would it be an issue if there is actually a small lip under the edge of the cyclone. I understand that this lip might catch some of the chips but will it affect the function.

Attached is the onieda cyclone kit Ihave and the 55 gallon blue barrel I want to use. 

 

 

 

Larry you know that barrel will be very heavy if you fill it. Mine is the next one up from your and I think my barrel is 25 gallon. The base on this one is less than the one you show. It has an area that is what I would call a space at the junction but the seal takes care of that and has not been a problem. I have only had this this year so no long term experience.

11 minutes ago, Gerald said:

Larry you know that barrel will be very heavy if you fill it. Mine is the next one up from your and I think my barrel is 25 gallon. The base on this one is less than the one you show. It has an area that is what I would call a space at the junction but the seal takes care of that and has not been a problem. I have only had this this year so no long term experience.

Yea I know it will be heavy if full, it still gives me more room even if I only fill it half way.   

 

The bottom of this cyclone is actually the lid for the barrel that came with it.   I just went and looked at the cyclone again and there is actually about 1.5 - 2 in. flat ring (the edge) which should allow the cyclone to sit flat without very much of a lip.

Edited November 15, 20196 yr by Larry Blighton

11 hours ago, Gerald said:

I use my DC on my PC sander and on my Rigid oscillating sander and they collect fine. I agree not the best use of a dc but much less noisy.

sanding creates a fine dust were anything that creates a chip creates a problem. I was running a line to the RAS when i paused thinking i might run a vacumn as the jet dc is a little annoying with the hum... the RAS does kick out some good little stabbing chips on dados..

One thing  and it's a really big thing,  it is an unlikely thing because physics tend to disfavor the  hazard, but  insurance companies take it ever so seriously.

DC ducting that is (a) not conductive and (b) not grounded is  not covered by any insurance company.

 

Insurers  apply industrial standards and don't give a toss about the fact that you are not industrial.  And in fact they can't because they would have to have different standards for  an unlimited number of  home shops.  So they just have the one.

 

If  there is a fire and if the adjuster can (and they might) say the ducting is where it started, then you don't get a check.

Yes you can mount a lawsuit  and present  the squads of experts to testify  and that law suit will cost you about what the house was worth - maybe more.

 

 

 

 

When I ran my shop my insurance company knew I ran a cabinet shop out of the garage and new that I ran an office from one of the bedrooms...

 

You don't have to lie to them but it does become a concern when you not only have gas and lacquer thinner, mineral spirits , pre-cat lacquers, urethanes,etc in the garage..it's also nice when your local fire dept. Knows these things are in the garage...

So what do I need to ground the dust collection system, I did see a video of someone who wound copper wire around his whole system.  I have never seen this done before.

Most just run a wire through it and ground on both ends. You have any ideal how many cabinet shops don't?

 

Just think about everytime you see pvc with dust collecting around the pipe it ain't  there for nothin...

 

Edited November 15, 20196 yr by BillyJack

Larry, don't over react to this: there is no known case of a PVC/DC system starting a fire. I suppose there's a risk you have one and the blame is fostered onto the DC ducting, but I have to think the chances are as close to zero as possible. Grounding the ductwork is about as big a PITA as you can imagine. Also, every time you change something (and you will) you have work around the wires. There's also no guarantee that the grounding will keep a claim from being denied anyway. But that's just my opinion.

It just lowers the chance of static build up. I know a few shop In kansas city that have 55 drums of  Lacquer and don't have them ground....

 

A lot of shops do go with metal over pvc just because of the static buildup....

 

#1....I have never seen static electricity start a fire...

 

Or

 

#2.... I have never seen stained rags thrown in a trash can start on fire?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 15, 20196 yr by BillyJack

ok another question, what is everyone using to hold there pipe to the walls and ceiling?

Depends on whether you use plastic or metal but they sell pipe strap at the home depot,etc..

 

Or pvc hangers...

 

Edited November 15, 20196 yr by BillyJack

In the past I made wooden hangers, and found them to be a fair amount of work. Making them wasn't too hard but hanging them and then placing the pipe was a small headache (pic below). In the current shop I went a different, and easier, way. I screwed a small piece of 3/4" thick wood to where ever I wanted a hanger. To that I screwed a small piece of 2x stock that had a small groove on the top side of it, the 2 pieces together gave me a little over 2" clearance to the ceiling, and the groove allowed me to slip a duct hanger strap into it. The duct hanger strap looked like a zip tie on steriods, they come in various lengths and easily went around the 6" pipe I used. Using these allowed me to make a large loop, then slip the pipe into it and line it up with the preceeding piece. Then tightening the strap clamped 'er down. In the second pic you can (almost) see the hangers.

Fred does it still look that clean. I think that is the most ingenious hanger I have see. I used galvanized wire (have a lot of clothes line wire) and bent to shape but required 2 screws and was a pain to fins stud or use inserts.

 

As to explosion risk as far as I know there has never been one in a home shop. Fires yes but not due to ducting ----they were caused by sparks feed to DC and left to smolder causing a fire many hours later. Now to the grounding it will hopefully short circuit the static build up but even when I had a ground I still got the static cling dust on the outside. To cause an explosion which is the main concern in large systems such as grain elevators and large literal cloud is required to cause the ignition problem and in the home shop with only one machine operating at a time it will likely never happen.

 

Oh I have read that the wire can be outside as well. The risk with inside the duct wire is blockage but again I never had one with mine. 

I do think that grounding can help with static shock, but I don't have any (static shock) in  my system. If I don't have it others may not either. Seems like waiting to see if it's a problem before you ground it would be a good approach. Even then, you might get away with just grounding the areas where you get shocked instead of the whole system. Using the duct straps for hanging wasn't my idea, someone on a forum (forgot where) suggested it, the wood blocks was just to make the process easier. What surprised me was that the straps weren't really all that expensive and they hold (rated) a few hundred pounds.  As you guessed, it isn't that clean anymore.

As far as using the blue plastic barrel - yes, go ahead and use it.   Get yourself one of those 4-caster dollies from HF or one of those 4-caster large tool dollies and put the barrel on that.   Then roll to wherever you need.

 

On 11/14/2019 at 12:30 PM, Larry Blighton said:

 If the equipment has less then a 4" dust port I will expand it to 4". 

If the equipment has less than a 4" dust port, it's a hint that the mfr of the fan/device doesn't expect the air flow to be that high, and your 4" duct might not have enough "transport velocity" to make sure the dust keeps moving.  OTOH, acting like a chimney sweep might be fun.  Ask Mary Poppins.

 

...I wonder if I could pipe something directly to a wood burner?