I'm afraid I'd have to give up woodworking before I would buy anything that would make Gass one single cent...

 

The man is a scumbag in my opinion. However, with 100+ patents he is either a friggin genius, or he has stolen other peoples ideas from them for pennies.

On 7/24/2017 at 7:00 AM, John Morris said:

I remember when the helmet law was put in place in our state, guess what industry suffered, organ donor industry! Yep, bikers were one of the largest groups of motorists to donate organs before the helmet law came into affect.

John, you just solved the age old question of why these last few generations have so many Loopy people running around all over. they are decedents of donated biker organs.

Just saying.

Herb

20 minutes ago, Dadio said:

John, you just solved the age old question of why these last few generations have so many Loopy people running around all over. they are decedents of donated biker organs.

Just saying.

Herb

Read yesterday that the new owner got physical assets as well as intellectual property (i.e., patents).

 

Also on today's news: http://www.npr.org/2017/08/10/542474093/despite-proven-technology-attempts-to-make-table-saws-safer-drag-on

I just read the first reference in this stream (govt doc).  OMG look at the TS injury stats:  age 61--70 has more loss than any other group, and that's in sharp contrast to non-TS injuries, where the youngest groups have more injuries.  With other tools, apparently, users get smarter as they get older.  TS users, not so, just the opposite.  I can hardly wait to enter the 71--80 age group and have a lower actuarial danger.  Sure. 

 

Confirms my opinion of my own stupidity.

 

I was interested to note that the proposed safety rule does not require flesh sensing.  It requires a specific performance (depth of cut in finger at "xx" blade speed).  I saw a video (decades old) where the machine had lanyards attached to the operator's wrists, and the lanyards would pull back when the machine activated, so no fingers in the way.  So, I'm buying some rope and working with my dog on a new trick.  Call me "stumpy".

That's not so far fetched. Some meat saws used in fast paced, high production scenarios, require the user to wear a specific blue colored vinyl glove. The saw sees the glove and shuts down, with a brake, when the glove gets to close to the blade. 

3 hours ago, PeteM said:

 

 

3 hours ago, PeteM said:

OMG look at the TS injury stats:  age 61--70 has more loss than any other

Maybe there is a lot of 61-70 yo who are taking up woodworking that never did it before and are unfamiliar with the risks of using power tools, (to put it nicely), or know more than the power tools,( to put it bluntly).  And the younger set are the new learners that put production above safety.

Just saying.

Herb

The only time I was ever seriously injured I was 40 yrs old and trying to do an hour's job in 20 minutes. 

8 hours ago, Gene Howe said:

That's not so far fetched. Some meat saws used in fast paced, high production scenarios, require the user to wear a specific blue colored vinyl glove. The saw sees the glove and shuts down, with a brake, when the glove gets to close to the blade. 

I had a co-worker who once worked at US Shoe.  He said that hides were put on a press and dies were arranged to cut out parts.  The guys were paid piece rate and got extra money if they got extra yield on a hide.  There were two handles with buttons on them to active the hydraulic press.   He said unless OSHA was there, one of them always had duct tape on the button.   Most of the guys had short fingers.

Old joke:

Q:  What's this?

 

 

A: A carpenter at a bar asking for three more beers.

 

13 hours ago, kmealy said:

There were two handles with buttons on them to active the hydraulic press

 

That story brings back bad memories!

 

The first accident investigation I ever investigate was when I was the Safety Director for Case Cutlery. We had a 100 year old rotary press that was designed to blank out a component. The machine was equipped with a sweep shield and two palm buttons. The woman operating the press had to place the component onto the die manually, retract her hand, then activate both buttons. This action cycled a sweep shield down (enclosing the area) and tripped the anvil.

 

She had defeated her dominant hand (right) button, so she could speed up her production. She would placed the component on the die, retract her hand, and while activating the hammer with her left hand, she would reach for the next piece with her right. Well, she screwed up her timing and accidentally tripped the hammer with the left palm button as she was placing the component onto the die. She might of saved her thumb and index finger if the stars were properly aligned and she had reacted a little quicker. Alas, the sweep guard had dropped, trapping her hand inside the "zone" as 80 tons of anvil dropped an pulverized her two digits.

 

It was a far from pretty sight.

On a less morbid note!

 

If the new owners have obtained the intellectual property from Gass as well as the physical assets, then there may be a light at the end of the tunnel! If Bosch truly did violate some of the patents with the Reaxx system, then there is still hope that the new owners are willing to negotiate a royalty deal to allow others to market similar systems.

 

We can only hope that there might be some form of collaboration between Saw Stop and Bosch. SS has the patents and Bosch has the better system. It would be really nice to see a mutually beneficial marriage between the two companies, marketing a "safe system".

 

I would consider a Saw Stop cabinet saw (since it doesn't line Bass's pockets) if it had a less damaging system like the Bosch. The saws ARE well made, and I don't see Bosch marketing a cabinet saw anytime soon in the US.

Given that those patents were from 2002 (give/take) I have to think they will expire sometime in the not-to-distant future. I wonder if the other companies are just waiting for that to happen, and then introduce their own stuff.

7 minutes ago, Fred W. Hargis Jr said:

Given that those patents were from 2002 (give/take) I have to think they will expire sometime in the not-to-distant future. I wonder if the other companies are just waiting for that to happen, and then introduce their own stuff.

If Gass still owned the co., I'm sure he'd find a way around that. Some small improvement he's had in his pocket, just waiting for the most profitable time to use it.

Isn't there some kind of extension on the 17 year patents now?

I checked and a patent after June 8,1995 filling is for 20 years.

 

 

3 minutes ago, Gerald said:

Isn't there some kind of extension on the 17 year patents now?

I checked and a patent after June 8,1995 filling is for 20 years.

I read the same thing a few years ago that the law was amended to give the  original company more time by renewing their patent. You can guess that Gass  has that base covered.

Herb

I think it is 20 years now, so if the 2002 date is correct (and it may not be) they might expire in another 5 years (that would also be give/take).

Sounds like no decision yet, article does not make it very clear.

 

http://www.woodworkingnetwork.com/news/woodworking-industry-news/table-saws-should-be-required-have-safety-mechanisms-says-ncl

7 minutes ago, kmealy said:

Sounds like no decision yet, article does not make it very clear.

 

http://www.woodworkingnetwork.com/news/woodworking-industry-news/table-saws-should-be-required-have-safety-mechanisms-says-ncl

My question is: If the ruling requires this type of technology to be equipped on ALL future TS's , will each company be required to either use SS technology or come up with their own version? This could turn into a circus of a jillion different  un-compatable solutions, unless one company would grant licenses at a reasonable cost to other companies to use their tachnology.

Herb

 

4 hours ago, Dadio said:

My question is: If the ruling requires this type of technology to be equipped on ALL future TS's , will each company be required to either use SS technology or come up with their own version? This could turn into a circus of a jillion different  un-compatable solutions, unless one company would grant licenses at a reasonable cost to other companies to use their tachnology.

Herb

 

 

Well, as I understand it, Gass et.al., would like to make the AIM standard and will sue anyone who comes up with a system that's not his.

49 minutes ago, kmealy said:

 

Well, as I understand it, Gass et.al., would like to make the AIM standard and will sue anyone who comes up with a system that's not his.

That is where this whole thing is headed ,I am afraid,Legislating a monopoly. I only hope that a more rational and reasonable solution is arrived at that doesn't amount to money under the table.

Herb