Death from Fractal Burnng

[Grandpadave52]

5 hours ago, p_toad said:

i see safety patent opportunities.   Wonder if there's a lawyer i can contact? 

I hear Steve Gass is looking for new work

[Marv V.]

Now that was a good response - as opposed to "why take a chance?"  I take a chance every morning when I get out of bed - or cross the street - or touch a gun.  This electrical engineer wrote a 4 page document on how to safely perform this process and I follow my rules.  

[Gene Howe]

One of my rules is that if it looks scary, don't do it. Electricity scares me. But, so does plumbing.

[kmealy]

And another death... https://www.woodworkingnetwork.com/news/woodworking-industry-news/fractal-burning-kills-another-michigan?utm_source=Real_Magnet&utm_medium=Email&utm_term=190116_DB&utm_content=DAILY BRIEF&utm_campaign=Fractal burning kills another

[John Morris]

Guys, is this process safe(r) if you are using the kits that are professionally manufactured? Such as this one: https://conestogaworks.com/woodburners.html

And does Carl Jacobson still use the process today?

 

Just genuinely curious is all, not trying to play Devils Advocate or anything. Thanks.

[Gene Howe]

Still scares me. And, the $300 price, if not revolting, is certainly shocking. 

[Roly]

Remember less dangerous does not mean safe.   First your are using two hands for the process shown, If for some reason both hands or even a finger touching the wood and the same on the other hand the current path is through the heart.  While 35 ma probably wont kill you instantly it will if the path is through your heart for a period of time.

 I don't recommend it for anyone not used to working high voltage.   The problem is people forget to take foot off of pedal or accidentally hit the pedal .   Would prefer to see a setup  that had to have a safety cage closed before it could be energized and some sort of remote so you hands were not on the probes.    I'll bet OSHA would have a cow if they saw it on a job site.  Roly

[HandyDan]

I agree with Roly but add proper safety suit and gloves.  What is the first thing we do when something starts to fall?  We instinctively grab for it.  Hands free when the power is applied from a remote area it the safest way.  I would not hold the probes and put the power to it for all the money especially where water is part of the equation. 

[kmealy]

1 hour ago, Gene Howe said:

Still scares me. And, the $300 price, if not revolting, is certainly shocking. 

groan

[Roly]

1 hour ago, HandyDan said:

I agree with Roly but add proper safety suit and gloves.  What is the first thing we do when something starts to fall?  We instinctively grab for it.  Hands free when the power is applied from a remote area it the safest way.  I would not hold the probes and put the power to it for all the money especially where water is part of the equation. 

The safety suit is for arc flash (which would not apply due to low available currents) not voltage protection.   Rubber gloves given the care and testing for safe use would not be practical for home use and for the cost concerns.   Our class 3 gloves were tested every three months in the lab and field tested at least every day.  When working with energized equipment you learn to react with restraint when things go south.

 I have concerns for inexperienced people working with high voltage.   If you do, have another person near by that knows how to de energize the unit, and preferably knows CPR.  Roly

Edited January 16, 2019 by Roly

[HandyDan]

10 minutes ago, Roly said:

The safety suit is for arc flash (which would not apply due to low available currents) not voltage protection.   Rubber gloves given the care and testing for safe use would not be practical for home use and for the cost concerns.

 

For the inexperienced I would think the more protection the better.  A guy would have a better chance if an errant electrode probe came into contact with a rubber glove or safety suit than a cloth shirt or bare skin.

[Artie]

I probably would do it (iff’n I had the urge) I probably would advise most people not to. Maybe the arrogance of being an electrician, maybe after reading about the manufactured versions, and feeling it is not any more dangerous than some of the aspects of my job. Honestly I just don’t have an appreciation for effect on wood.

[DAB]

pass.

 

i'll watch.

 

from way over here.  with 911 on speed dial.

Edited January 16, 2019 by DAB

[Gunny]

3 minutes ago, HandyDan said:

For the inexperienced I would think the more protection the better.

See that is the problem.  Fools go where Angels dare to tread.  Take my neighbor up the street.  His car battery was dead so he decided to jump it off.  Got an extension cord, cut the end of and exposed two wires then touched the battery.  Was insane, the battery blew up and he went flying about 10 feet. The acid burns might have been worse but I dumped a gallon of milk on him and the other neighbor called 911.

 

Or my next door neighbor who decided to tell his Girlfriend to use jumper cables to hook the power up to the house at the meter box.  It had been removed for failure to pay bill.  The jumper cables were old and bare at the handles.  All I heard was a deathly scream and then silence.  Came out and she was on fire on the ground.  Did not make it.  

[Grandpadave52]

I guess if hi-speed rotating sharp things doesn't provide enough hazard in the shop then by all means add hi-voltage/amperage electricity and wet wood to the equation.

I was never one to jump off bridges just because all my friends did; I lost count of the times I answered that question under home interrogation and no, pleading the 5th was not an option.

I'll stick to the basic rule water & electricity don't mix...if I need shocked, I'll leave that to the paramedics.

Edited January 17, 2019 by Grandpadave52

[Gunny]

49 minutes ago, Grandpadave52 said:

I guess if hi-speed rotating sharp things doesn't provide enough hazard in the shop then by all means add hi-voltage/amperage electricity and wet wood to the equation.

[Dadio]

7 hours ago, John Morris said:

Guys, is this process safe(r) if you are using the kits that are professionally manufactured? Such as this one: https://conestogaworks.com/woodburners.html

And does Carl Jacobson still use the process today?

Just genuinely curious is all, not trying to play Devils Advocate or anything. Thanks.

That was the unit I was using, John, and it comes with many cautions and warnings in the manual. I sold it to an Electical Engineer who works with high voltage every day, I talked to him at the last meeting and he said he hasn't tried it out yet but did buy the $285. linemans gloves rated at 15Kv.

Herb

[Kevin Beitz]

This is something I dabble with...