People Take Warning by Christopher Schwarz

[John Morris]

I received an interesting news letter by Highland Woodworking this morning with a link to the following article, a plea to buy quality, over cheap. And to support the American worker.

 

People Take Warning

OPEN.SUBSTACK.COM

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Your favorite toolmaker can disappear.

 

[PeteM]

I've always felt that in a world where so many make about $1200 per year, how long can we hold out?  By concentrating on higher value services/products, we've managed to stave off the rest of the world for about 80 years.  I think we're running out of tricks.

     At this point, can it be reversed?  The US is 5% of world population, 25% of world production.  Everyone wants a chip off the rock.  My long time ambition has been not living on a dirt floor for me or my kids.  I'm buying sandals for my g-kids.

[DAB]

you charge how much for a simple table?  bah!  i'll get it at Ikea......wash, rinse, repeat, and you get the same result, no one can make a living just making custom furniture.  or making tools......

[John Morris]

8 minutes ago, DAB said:

no one can make a living just making custom furniture.  or making tools......

Respectfully disagree Dab with the blanket statement, many make a living building custom furniture and making tools, that segment of society is all over the place.

[PeteM]

4 hours ago, DAB said:

you charge how much for a simple table?  bah!  i'll get it at Ikea......wash, rinse, repeat, and you get the same result, no one can make a living just making custom furniture.  or making tools......

I had a friend who had a day job in construction (as project manager, not hammer swinger), and his pay was about $85k for the day job.  He was (is) a real master mechanic at all sorts of things, but his evening and weekends were spent on pretty sophisticated wood projects (industrial display furniture for example), and the night job made him more than the day job.  All the woodshops in town had his card and recommended him to any client looking for custom items.  I agree that Ikea is a better source for just common use, no customization; but for those who want it "just so", a master craftsman can make a good living.

[steven newman]

When it comes down to either paying the Rent ($700/Mo.) or paying for a car ($332/mo.)  plus all the other expenses during a month, EVERY Month....where is the room in the Budget for a $$$ tool?    Given a choice between a place to live, or somebody's $400+ plane?   Think on THAT for  a bit.....

[John Morris]

49 minutes ago, steven newman said:

Given a choice between a place to live, or somebody's $400+ plane?   Think on THAT for  a bit.....

That's why in the article Steve, Schwarz stated if a high value high dollar USA made plane cannot be afforded, another best alternative is the used hand tool market, Stanley's and such (I'm pretty sure you'd agree on that point ). His point was, stop supporting the cheap offshore Chinese brands. He also said, you'd have to put in the work on an old Stanley to make it usable, and you'd have to put just as much work on the new Chinese plane too, so why not just get a good ol Stanley. 

[steven newman]

I am quite ok with using Vintage..

Stanley No. 3, Type 15....seems to work quite well...

[JWD]

I have mixed feelings about that article.  I tend to agree in principle with his thesis, but in practice I find so many exceptions that I'm not sure he's on the right track.  I'm not really sure that this warning is as effective as he hopes.  He alludes to that towards the end, I think he knows he's kinda shouting at the clouds.

 

Honestly, I think he just doesn't care for some of the more unpleasant aspects of economic reality.  I can sympathize, I don't care for them either.  But as I don't have such a tall soap box, I've learned not to spend my time railing against the parts of reality that I don't like.

 

On a more positive note, I think his best advice in there is buying vintage tools - even when they are expensive they are a better deal than new.

[John Morris]

1 hour ago, JWD said:

I have mixed feelings about that article. 

I did too JWD, there is a lot that can be unpacked from what he said. There are so many variables and conditions that go into someones decision to purchasing what they need for their hobby and business as well, it truly is to each his own on this one. It's hard to just throw a pretty blanket over all of it and yell "support the American worker!". It's not always that cut and dry and easy to do. In my own life, when I first put my garage shop together 23 years ago, I bought mainly Grizzly, because at the time it was inexpensive, and I could not afford the USA brands. I didn't lose sleep over it either. I wanted to woodwork.

 

I've downsized a whole lot since then, I have a Shopsmith, and a Laguna Lathe, that's it, and all my hand tools. The machinery went bye bye about 6 years ago for various reasons, one of them being I wanted to force myself to use more hand tools.

One of his points though, I do think he hit the nail on the head with hand tools, buy new hand tools American "IF" you can because he is right, they are superior than the vintage tools, if you can't afford those shiny new hand planes from Lie Nielson, buy vintage, because they are superior than the new Chinese knock offs, and they work very sweet!

[DAB]

i've got a small handful of planes on my shelf, mini to large, all either ones my wife had (likely from her dad), or ones i was given by friends who knew about my shop.  never bought one new.  and they largely live quiet lives on their shelf, i rarely use any of them.  if I need to straighten or smooth out a board, it either sees my jointer (6" bench top), my planer (13" Dewalt) or my TS.  as much as I enjoy working in my shop, when i'm down there, my goal is to get the project done, not to get into some "zen" zone where i become one with the tools.  if you want to limit  yourself to hand tools, go for it.  i limit myself to tools i can afford and know how to use.

Edited November 22, 2024 by DAB

[John Morris]

59 minutes ago, DAB said:

 if you want to limit  yourself to hand tools, go for it.

Actually Dab, I find hand tools quite liberating. To each their own

[steven newman]

Main reason I started using hand tools...is there is a finite amount of room in the Dungeon Woodshop....so I have learned how to get along with out the machine world....Shop IS a Hybrid Shop....where I do use the tool best suited to do a task....as long as I have said tool IN my shop...if not...I go back a 100 yrs and do it that way....

[Gerald]

12 minutes ago, steven newman said:

Main reason I started using hand tools...is there is a finite amount of room in the Dungeon Woodshop....so I have learned how to get along with out the machine world....Shop IS a Hybrid Shop....where I do use the tool best suited to do a task....as long as I have said tool IN my shop...if not...I go back a 100 yrs and do it that way....

But if you keep finding these "bargains" you will run out of room soon. I still think you must use a gun

[Gene Howe]

Although I have sporadically made $ woodworking, my time in the shop is largely for my own enjoyment. My tool purchases reflect that. It ain't fun trying to make cheap, crappy tools work right. And, if it's not fun I ain't doin' it.

[steven newman]

The old phrase..."Buy the best tool you can afford"?     Boils down to 2 words....."YOU".....and "AFFORD"......and NOT what others THINK you can afford....

 

Some can afford to buy out the entire Veritas Catalog of tools.....and...others can't.      Simple as that....and there is zero need to Shame a person because they can NOT afford the tools YOU can.  Unless you happen to be a Commissioned Sales Rep.......

[kmealy]

Ran into a friend who is the  widow of a late other friend who was a hobby woodworker.  He passed 2 years ago and she is still  whittling down his tools, despite going to a dealer and putting most of the big stuff on consignment.  I bought a Bosch jig saw from her.

[John Morris]

On 12/5/2024 at 9:29 PM, steven newman said:

Simple as that....and there is zero need to Shame a person because they can NOT afford the tools YOU can.

That sentiment was not here Steven, not in Chris's article nor here in my topic.

[kmealy]

https://paulsellers.com/2024/12/my-accuracy/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=weekly

[John Morris]

@kmealy, good article.