Hi all, been awhile since I posted - hope all is well with everyone.

 

I have a question about a cabinet I built back in 2013 - here it is

 

 

At the time the doors closed fine - but now they look like this - and no matter what I do with the hinges, I cannot get them to close properly.  The entire cabinet is made of Baltic Birch, and sealed with several layers of poly.  They dont seem to be warped (which I did not think baltic birch would do anyway).

 

My novice opinion is that one of my levelers failed and the entire cabinet is wrenched, skewed, twisted - whatever the proper term would be.  The cabinet is totally full with different books and other materials and I really hate to have to empty it unless I have too.

 

So - what are your opinions?

 

Thanks  - it is weird how it is the top of one door and the bottom of the other door.

 

Hinges aren't strong enough to handle the weight. Try bigger hinges or a piano hinge on both sides. Also check to make sure the cabinet hasn't racked and that the corners are still square.

Edited January 31, 20206 yr by DRAGON1
Oops

First determine if the doors are still flat, and check the cabinet as well.  Let's eliminate that as an issue.  If flat then the hinges may need adjusting.  That style can be adjusted in and out, as well as up and down to make the doors line up.  Just looking at it I am leaning towards the doors are warped.  If they are the next question is why?  I have never used plywood as a door before, typically I make mine with a frame and insert, like a picture frame.  

 

Perhaps someone else can offer other suggestions.  

 

Like this.

 

I well remember this project and it seems from the pictures that the doors have indeed warped.  I would verify that issue first as @Woodbutcherbynight so well said.  It is possible that you can steam them or removed the doors and put wet towels over them on a hot summer day.  Weight them to see if they will straighten.  Maybe others have more experience and can offer better advice.  Watching this project.  

12 hours ago, FlGatorwood said:

It is possible that you can steam them or removed the doors and put wet towels over them...

 I would try the steam or towel method. Maybe then install a magnetic catch inside top & bottom to try keeping them flat.

Good to see you posting again Bob, hope you are doing well.

I'd bet the plywood has warped. If true, you might be able to flatten it, but it won't stay flat...at least that's been my experience. If there's room, you might be able to put "strongbacks" on the inside. That's just a stiff piece of hardwood screwed to the inside to keep the ply straight. Yu could put them in any direction, but the pic below shows some.

Edited January 31, 20206 yr by Fred W. Hargis Jr

On 2/1/2020 at 3:49 AM, Fred W. Hargis Jr said:

I'd bet the plywood has warped. If true, you might be able to flatten it, but it won't stay flat...at least that's been my experience. If there's room, you might be able to put "strongbacks" on the inside. That's just a stiff piece of hardwood screwed to the inside to keep the ply straight. Yu could put them in any direction, but the pic below shows some.

 

Would that work in this instance though? And how thick a door material might escape this? I'm going to be making some doors with ~19mm glue-lam beech shortly, and I don't want them warping either. They'll be sealed with clear poly and hung on good cabinet hinges.

 

I doubt it will work to completely flatten the doors, might be worth a try but I suspect it will only help a little. They work best when installed on already flat doors, then they seem to prevent warping. That said, those doors are fairly large so it's a guessing game.

Thanks all - next time I head there to do some work gonna take a long straight edge to see if they are in fact warped - just seems strange to me they are in opposite directions - one on top - other on bottom. Seems more like somehow the cabinet got racked (JMHO) - but gonna check it out

 

Thanks all!

16 hours ago, IrishWoodCarver said:

just seems strange to me they are in opposite directions

 Bob, were those doors cut from the same sheet of plywood? Your other cabinet appears fine and it had me thinking maybe if there was stress or warp in the full sheet if it just remained. After the cut the board might have relaxed enough to lay flat only to reappear later. I'll agree it's strange.

I'm wondering if the cabinet got racked somehow.

On 1/30/2020 at 8:45 PM, Woodbutcherbynight said:

First determine if the doors are still flat, and check the cabinet as well.  Let's eliminate that as an issue.  If flat then the hinges may need adjusting.  That style can be adjusted in and out, as well as up and down to make the doors line up.  Just looking at it I am leaning towards the doors are warped.  If they are the next question is why?  I have never used plywood as a door before, typically I make mine with a frame and insert, like a picture frame.  

 

 

This ^^^  The hinges have a 3-axis adjustment

Sometimes, though, a twist (other describe as racking) in a carcase will cause the doors to go whopper-jawed.   I have fixed many entertainment centers with this problem and some hinges to level out the floor got everything back into alignment.

 

I believe any attempt to "unwarp" a panel door is a short-lived solution.   Eventually, it will reach EMC.   I remember years ago, I made a box for a book on finishing.   I resawed an 8/4 piece of curly maple and bookmatched the lid.  By the time I got it all together, the top had warped badly.   I took it to the publisher anyway, who thought he might be able to fix it and by the time he got it to the finisher, the wood had evened out moisture and it was flat again.   Still flat 20 years later.

Bet you need a wedge under one corner of your cabinet.

I have the same thing on a set of cabinets....6 cabinets! 12 doors!  All with the same.  In my case (please note:  I try to avoid remote diagnostics:  I'll tell you my problems, you translate as best you can!), so in my cases, I realized some things:

--it's 1/2" plywood, and even in BB don't expect miracles

--BB ain't the perfect you might think:  there are grades of BB, and many purveyors don't even realize that. 

--my doors are 48" high:  that's a lot of length, and any bit of warping gets doubled with matching doors

--I used two hinges:  the cabinets (3/4) provide a lot of the stability to the doors, and two hinges put much of the door line out of range of the stability point.  If the hinge side warps, the opposite side warps even more

--1/2" is just plain thin, and time curls all wood.  Somewhat.  "Flange" strips of wood at the meeting lines would have added stability.  Even something like long handles, near the opening edges, would have reduced the warp.  Or, metal angles.  Edges need stiffening.

--I added 1/8" strips on the inside of one leaf on the door pairs, just to close the vision gap:  that actually improved the fit.  A bit.  Thicker = straighter I think.

--They're storage cabinets and I'm the only one who sees them so I pretend not to care.  So there.

 

best wishes

Just a thought about plywood from the big box stores. $35 a sheet plywood may look good but it isn't as well made as the $170.00 a sheet Baltic Birch stuff sold at high end mills. The expensive stuff is almost 100% stable with little or no voids inside the plywood.

To my knowledge, aside from different uses, i.e exterior, interior, underlayment, etc., BB is only graded by it's face sheet quality. Unlike other plywoods that are graded as to interior laminate quality as well as face sheet quality. Although, I've never had a sheet of true BB with interior voids. The suppliers I use cater to cabinet makers, though. It would be interesting to know how their buyers determine which ones to stock. I'm sure they are a mite more discriminating than those at HD, lowes or Menards.

Take a straight edge or level 48" from top to bottom of door.Is there a gap or not. No gap cabinet needs twisting. If it's a gap in the door most likely door. From the pictures I would twist the cabinet. This is one of the reasons for scribe on the cabinet or applied....

 

Looks like the cabinet finally settled....

Edited February 5, 20206 yr by BillyJack

My experience has taught me that there is NO fix to warped plywood---tried much-never succeeded.

Because it's warped in reverse it's an easy fix. Just have to twist the cabinet. 

 

I could have that fixed I  in minutes...a shim, scribe,hammer and a screw gun....

Based on what you see, if you were looking at the cabinet from the right end - would it have to twist clockwise - or - counter clockwise?

 

Thanks (wish you lived closer - LOL)

 

Bob