15 minutes ago, John Morris said:

There's a simple cure for that Stick, soak it overnight in a tub of water. Works great! A little trick chair builder and friend Russ Filbeck taught me a few years back when I was in his shop and we were discussing this exact circumstance.

But to answer your question, I'll be working with whatever is available at the time I purchase the lumber. Kiln or air dried, no matter.

what do you do about fiber separation...

psst.. I added a bit more to the original post.....

Just now, Stick486 said:

what do you do about fiber separation...

Not quite sure yet Stick, I have a lot to learn about steam bending, but I am sure there are ways around it, if it's even a problem, I am sure it depends on species too, I would imagine that walnut would be more problematic than say maple or cherry. I'll be taking my lumps as I go that's for sure!

37 minutes ago, Stick486 said:

notes...

wall paper steamers for a steam supply are great...
if you use a kettle and run out of water in the kettle swap the empty for a kettle of already boiling water so that steaming process isn't interrupted..

double wall stove pipe/components would be even easier... B vent would work too...
single walled stove and a thermal blanket....

the insulation is to protect you more than anything but it does help your process...

 

time and temp matter... One hour per inch of thickness w/ real live steam.

Better too much steam than too little....

 

Expect to the PVC to plasticize at around 140° and you risk off gasing w/ cyanide gas...,,

MDF to disintegrate..

MDO to last for a time...

Sheet metal to be forever... cheapest option too...

the BB's will have everything you need in the HVAC isle.. round. square or rectangle...

 

PS... Herb (Dadio) built a great box...

Thanks for adding "notes" Stick, great information!

1 hour ago, John Moody said:

 

John, I haven't had a chance to use it yet, but I bought a Jewelers Steamer for cleaning jewelry. I got it at an auction for 10.00. My thoughts were use it for steam bending. Maybe I can get it out and hook it up. I'll try to get a picture of it today and post.

 

21 minutes ago, John Morris said:

Thanks John! When you get a chance that would be great!

After reading this, my single cell hard drive reformatted and put this idea on the screen. We have one in storage somewhere as part of daughter's wedding dress fiasco from a few years back. Could one of these be adapted to work? Several types out there and I occasionally see them at yard sales probably from their own wedding dress encounters. Just a thought.

 

Garment Steamer

Man, that's a good looking addition, Moody. Your M&Ms were well spent. Is your knee better? I worry about you old guys.

 

Most of yesterday was spent finding and fixing slight mistakes made in milling components three weeks ago. I just love it when errors aren't apparent until assembly. Plans? Who needs 'em? Anyway, today will be more of the same. Just glad my mistakes showed up before the glue up. Lesson learned...short cuts aren't.

8 minutes ago, Grandpadave52 said:

 

After reading this, my single cell hard drive reformatted and put this idea on the screen. We have one in storage somewhere as part of daughter's wedding dress fiasco from a few years back. Could one of these be adapted to work? Several types out there and I occasionally see them at yard sales probably from their own wedding dress encounters. Just a thought.

 

Garment Steamer

I am not sure if that would work or not Dave, at first site it does not appears it could hold enough water to steam as long as may be needed, the book I am reading Chair Making Simplified by Kerry Pierce he seems to gravitate towards containers that hold a couple gallons of water, and the steam that is expelled from the container is being heated by a larger element. One thing he does recommend as a quick and easy steamer without having to build one, is to purchase a wall paper remover steamer from the big box store, he states it's sufficient, and holds enough water.

 

8 minutes ago, Grandpadave52 said:

 

After reading this, my single cell hard drive reformatted and put this idea on the screen. We have one in storage somewhere as part of daughter's wedding dress fiasco from a few years back. Could one of these be adapted to work? Several types out there and I occasionally see them at yard sales probably from their own wedding dress encounters. Just a thought.

 

Garment Steamer

I am not sure if that would work or not Dave, at first site it does not appears it could hold enough water to steam as long as may be needed, the book I am reading Chair Making Simplified by Kerry Pierce he seems to gravitate towards containers that hold a couple gallons of water, and the steam that is expelled from the container is being heated by a larger element. One thing he does recommend as a quick and easy steamer without having to build one, is to purchase a wall paper remover steamer from the big box store, he states it's sufficient, and holds enough water.

 

I went to a local thrift store and picked up these types of items-

 

 

Modified the kettle whistle to accept the plumbing to connect to the steam box. Not sure if the kettle would hold enough water for steaming a chair back post.

 

I think Scott Phillips built a steam box in one of the American Woodshop episodes.

 

Here's another idea-

steambox.pdf

 

 

3 minutes ago, lew said:

Modified the kettle whistle to accept the plumbing to connect to the steam box. Not sure if the kettle would hold enough water for steaming a chair back post.

 

I think Scott Phillips built a steam box in one of the American Woodshop episodes.

 

Here's another idea-

steambox.pdf

Thanks Lew!

 

John, I'm certainly no expert at steam bending but, I've bent a few pieces for edging round table tops. 

The woods used were oak, walnut and maple. The dimensions were 5/8 X 1-1/2 X 7'. It's been a while ago but IIRC, it was KD.

I used a length of 4" black plastic pipe. Might have been sewer pipe but, I remember it being thicker. Used un glued caps at both ends. Filled the pipe about half full of water and added about a quarter of a bottle of Downey fabric softener. Stuck in 3 or 4 lengths of whichever species needed, capped it off and laid it on a concrete driveway. This was summertime, south of Phoenix where the temps routinely reached 110++. After 6-8 hours, the wood was like spaghetti. I usually used one piece right away and left the others to stew till the next day, or even later.

I used this process several times over the next few years. It always worked...in the summer. 

There were no ill effects from the Downey. After the wood dried, it sanded and finished well.

It might be a good experiment to add Downey to the water in the steamer to see if you could shorten the steam time and/or make the wood more pliable.

 

Edited September 24, 20169 yr by Gene Howe

2 minutes ago, Gene Howe said:

John, I'm certainly no expert at steam bending but, I've bent a few pieces for edging round table tops. 

The woods used were oak, walnut and maple. The dimensions were 5/8 X 1-1/2 X 7'. It's been a while ago but IIRC, it was KD.

I used a length of 4" black plastic pipe. Might have been sewer pipe but, I remember it being thicker. Used un glued caps at both ends. Filled the pipe about half full of water and added about a quarter of a bottle of Downey fabric softener. Stuck in 3 or 4 lengths of whichever species needed, capped it off and laid it on a concrete driveway. This was summertime, south of Phoenix where the temps routinely reached 110++. After 6-8 hours, the wood was like spaghetti. I usually used one piece right away and left the others to stew till the next day, or even later.

I used this process several times over the next few years. It always worked...in the summer. 

There were no ill effects from the Downey. After the wood dried, it sanded and finished well.

 

 

This is really cool Gene, thanks! Kind of like "Sun Tea" right? The benefits of living in warm country!

John, did you see my edit?

41 minutes ago, Gene Howe said:

It might be a good experiment to add Downey to the water in the steamer to see if you could shorten the steam time and/or make the wood more pliable.

 

This one? Yes, just now.

Yup.

1 minute ago, Gene Howe said:

Yup.

Thanks sir.

Here's how Norm steamed the wood.

 

 

After watching Norm, I thought of another possible advantage to using Downy. The wood stays pliable a bit longer so you wouldn't need to hurry the bending process.

John, I will relate my experience with steam bending here are some boxes I made. As you can see the PVC one collapsed after 45 min of steam.  The MDO plywood held up fine .

Stick is correct in not using kiln dried material. I even soaked it for 4 days and it still didn't bend, I broke  every piece. It did bend better but still broke. I was tryng to bend maple and white oak, both the same results. Finally abandoned the project and gave the steam box away.

The steam generator I was using was a carpet steam cleaner, the Temp gage for the box was a BBQ one bought at Lowes, the supports for the wood inside the box wre long gutter nails from Ace hardware.The MDF plywood was 1/2" Melimine both sides. I used construction adhesive and SS screws.

Hope this helps.

, Herb

 

 

7 hours ago, Dadio said:

Hope this helps.

This helps a lot Herb, thanks so much! I need feedback from all sides of this project.

15 hours ago, John Morris said:

This helps a lot Herb, thanks so much! I need feedback from all sides of this project.

Correction to the above, the plywood steam box was not MDF, it was MDO, Medium Density Overlay,. there is also a HDO High Density Overlay too , both can be purchased in one side or both sides at the lumber yard. Very good material for concrete forms leaving a very smooth surface on concrete, and reusable many times. A high grade moisture resistant  plywood.

Another point it make your box sloping to drain the condensate water out, also vent the high end with a small hole to relieve the steam pressure.