I have this question: When attaching a face frame to a cabinet (pocket screws not an option), will the glue be enough to keep the frame on the cabinet when a door is attached to the face frame or do I need to do something more?

 

The door will be about 20" wide x 36" tall and I am using Amerock Half Wrap, 1/2" Overlay, Self-Closing hinges.

 

Thank you for the help.

Glue will be enough Chips, it's a good surface joint. But I usually end up hitting the face frame with a few pins just to hold it in place while I get the clamps on the face frame. The face frame tends to drift a tad while clamping unless they are tacked in place.

 

EDIT: I am assuming you are using 3/4" solid wood for your carcass. If you're using ply, you may have some issues with open ply's absorbing glue, in which case, that's a no go. You'll need fastners all the way around. 

Thanks John!

1 minute ago, Chips N Dust said:

Thanks John!

You bet, see my edit Chips. Regarding solid wood and ply.

I usually do this

 

 

 

Makes for a really strong cabinet

 

Nice one Lew, that's even better.

58 minutes ago, John Morris said:

You bet, see my edit Chips. Regarding solid wood and ply.

 Yeah, plywood sides and solid wood face frame. How about treating the ply edge with glue/water mix (I forget the technical name of that stuff)?

27 minutes ago, lew said:

I usually do this

 

Makes for a really strong cabinet

 

Thanks Lew, but it is too late for this method, the cabinet is already built.

1 hour ago, Chips N Dust said:

 Yeah, plywood sides and solid wood face frame. How about treating the ply edge with glue/water mix (I forget the technical name of that stuff)?

That's works.

Another option is a rabbit in the face frame to add more glue surface and reduce racking. This would make the face frame set 3/8 to 1/2 deeper into the cabinet depending on how deep the rabbit is.

2 hours ago, lew said:

I usually do this

 

 

Makes for a really strong cabinet

 

me too and yes it does...

sometimes  full dado and not a rebated one...

23GA pins are placed sideways and not through the face...

Edited October 6, 20169 yr by Stick486

I have done it with plywood sides using biscuits to add some more grab.

+1 for biscuits.  Quick to do, doesn't show like a brad would

Lew's method is the way I've always done it. However, a full dado in the FF would be an alternative since the carcass is built already. 

For "sizing" on the plywood edges, watering down the glue isn't really necessary. Just an ultra thin coat, spread and pressed in with a finger or credit card will do the trick.

Biscuits are usually my first choice for FF to the carcase. They alos help keep everything aligned while I'm fussing with clamps.

And a spline works too.

1 hour ago, tomp said:

And a spline works too.

that it does and really well too..

I usually lay the carcuss on a pair of horses and then the face frame on the carcuss and it is a sinch to move any part that may be sticking where you don't want it to be as you clamp

Edited October 6, 20169 yr by Ralph Allen Jones

On 10/5/2016 at 6:41 PM, Chips N Dust said:

 Yeah, plywood sides and solid wood face frame. How about treating the ply edge with glue/water mix (I forget the technical name of that stuff)?

Since roughly half of a plywood edge is end grain, sizing could be used.  Two reasons I use biscuits is that

1. lt keeps things from sliding around out of place while you are trying to get clamps on.

2. Often the face frame is subject to a little more stress such as hinges, picking up by the frame, etc.

 

On shelf edges, I'm happy just putting some glue on and clamping down with a caul, or do a wide facing between to plywood shelves and rip into two (eliminates the need for a caul and additional clamps).

 

I've also become a fan of Titebond's  No-Run No-Drip and Thick and Quick glues for short and end grain work.  (or where I don't want squeeze out or drips,  or need a quick set up,too)

 

Franklin Int'l (Titebond people) say this about sizing:  (emphasis mine)

Get good results gluing end grain joints.

Although good joint design minimizes the need for gluing end grain, sometimes end grain joints are unavoidable. The strength of end grain joints can be improved if the "open" end grain is first sized. A sizing mixture may be made by mixing one part to two parts water to one part glue. Place the sizing mixture on the end grain. Let it soak in for no more than two minutes, and then continue with a regular application of glue.

Edited October 7, 20169 yr by kmealy

full ¼'' deep dado face frame..

makes for a major rigid box and seriously straight panels..

glides fitted for drawer face and doors dust lipped...

drawer faces are not add ons and are integral to the drawer construction...