Good Morning Friends,

When you are starting a project, you can eliminate the need for a jointer by cutting the boards to the approximate size before running them through the planer and therefore eliminate the need for a jointer. Be carful to mark the ends of the boards with the number or letter of where they go in the project.

Respectfully,
Ralph Jones

I am trying to envision this one Ralph. How does this eliminate the need the need for a joiner. Can you please elaborate?

One would still have to joint the edges if your gluing them up to each other wouldn't you?

Just having a hard time visualizing is all.

Hi John,

I got rid of my jointer a few years ago for it was not being used other than to drawing dus for I use Titanium blades on my saws and they are 40 tooth thin kerf and there is no need to joint them for the edges are so smooth you can just glue them up right from the table saw.

Now if one were to not cut the pieces to a rough size for the project being about to build you would/could have some defects, cups, bows an anything but a straight board. So be cutting them to a rough length and width you avoid any problems of this occuring when running them through the planer. First look at the board to see if it hac a cup. f so adjust your planer and run the board through a few times while lightly taking some wood off the top of the cup and then when you have a flat ara of about 3" wide it will ride flat on the planer table then start taking off the sled runners till it is almost down to the bottom of the cup. Then by doing that your board will run through the planer level and flat and each time you reset the depth, run it through and then flip it over 180º side to side and run it through again on the same setting.

This will give you a flat board that needs no jointing. I have been doing it for over four years now and don't need jointer and if I am right you have seen some of my work and if not here is one.

Thanks, you clarified your methodology here,

And, looks like you found how to load pics directly, great job Ralph!

And nice bath vanity, I remember when you made that.

I'm glad John jumped in and ask, I thought I was just missing something.

I might have to give that a try it I have a wide board, but I still run anything 6" wide or less across the joiner.

If I can get the results Ralph gets though, I might switch methods.

I completely agree with you Ralph. When I had my good old cast iron table saw with a high quality blade, such as Woodworker ll or Frued Glueline, The cuts were so true and smooth that I didn't need a jointer. However you must have a quality tablesaw, blade and always check the blade for squareness. My table saw now is a contractor's saw that folds because of limited shop space. I can still do it, but it take much extra care to get things right.

I sure admire you guys that can get away with this, it just seems that I always need to put my stock up on the joiner to assure square. Someday, I'll have to get into my tablesaw and really square that puppy up.

Ron Altier said:

I completely agree with you Ralph. When I had my good old cast iron table saw with a high quality blade, such as Woodworker ll or Frued Glueline, The cuts were so true and smooth that I didn't need a jointer. However you must have a quality tablesaw, blade and always check the blade for squareness. My table saw now is a contractor's saw that folds because of limited shop space. I can still do it, but it take much extra care to get things right.

Ron,

You are 100% correct as the saw must be set up so the blade is a true 90º to the table and of a good quuality that will leave a ribbon smooth cut on the edge of the boards and over the years I have found that a good quality thin kerfed blade is the blade of choice to make such a cut and the new titanium blades are the best quality blade on the market. The Italian blade of choice would be the Freud 40 tooth blade.

Respectfully,

Ralph

The American Woodworker said:

I sure admire you guys that can get away with this, it just seems that I always need to put my stock up on the joiner to assure square. Someday, I'll have to get into my tablesaw and really square that puppy up.

Ron Altier said:

Good Morning Friend,

There is no need to admire us for all you need to do is to really give your table saw a tune up and to do this is to forget the gauge under the table that says the saw is set on "0" for the little finger that indicates the saw to be on "0" can be off ever so slightly. When I return my saw blade from an angle cut I use my combination square and set it so I am looking at a true 90º and I rest the body on the table top and slide the square to the blade in between the teeth and adjust the saw till I se no light between the saw blade and the square. Then and only then do I consider the saw to be set on a true 90º.

Respectfully,

Ralph

The American Woodworker said:

I sure admire you guys that can get away with this, it just seems that I always need to put my stock up on the joiner to assure square. Someday, I'll have to get into my tablesaw and really square that puppy up.

Ron Altier said:

I should probably elaborate, my tablesaw is square when I want it to be. I use the square as well Ralph, and that does a great job. It would be nice to be able to max out the wheel at the stop, and have the blade square to the table but in the real world we all know that rarely happens, and when we do get it adjusted out, it doesn't last long. But I agree, I always use the square as well. Lately I have been using the joiner a lot because I am using 8/4 material rough that needs to be flattened on two adjacent sides for a frame of reference for the table saw to be effective.

I think this is where a person would need a joiner, if they are working with rough stock frequently, I don't know how you could square up stock easily in the rough on the TS, sure it can be done, but the joiner in my opinion would be so much easier to square rough stock then a tablesaw.

Good Morning Friend,

I square all of my rough lumber by using a 10' straight edge I constructed with a stif back on the edge next to the fence so when it runs off the out feed table it won't sag but remain level with the rough sawn board. I first find the crown of the board and place the concaved side against the straight edge and take of the crown to arrive to a straight edged board. Then by doing this there is no need for a jointer. I know that old habits and being told that the only way to true a board are hard to break but, one must try the method of a straight edge and table saw to find that you can true a board without a jointer.

Respectfully,

Ralph

The American Woodworker said:

I should probably elaborate, my tablesaw is square when I want it to be. I use the square as well Ralph, and that does a great job. It would be nice to be able to max out the wheel at the stop, and have the blade square to the table but in the real world we all know that rarely happens, and when we do get it adjusted out, it doesn't last long. But I agree, I always use the square as well. Lately I have been using the joiner a lot because I am using 8/4 material rough that needs to be flattened on two adjacent sides for a frame of reference for the table saw to be effective.
I think this is where a person would need a joiner, if they are working with rough stock frequently, I don't know how you could square up stock easily in the rough on the TS, sure it can be done, but the joiner in my opinion would be so much easier to square rough stock then a tablesaw.

Yep, straight edge, been there done that Ralph before I had a joiner. Joiner IMO is still the tool of choice for this, we can agree to disagree on this one!

I do check it with the square, but I use my Wixey to set my blade to 0. I do use my joiner almost daily, but when I am making cutting boards, I square on edge and face on the joiner and after running it through the planer I cut all of the pieces on the table saw that I edge glue. I like the Freud 40 tooth blade for this also.

I agree with you Ralph that you can't depend on the little arrow on the saw to make sure it is at zero.

I like knowing I can rip those pieces on glue them up and have a good edge, but I am also not ready to completely let my joiner go. It doesn't take but a minute to straighten an edge and a face. Doesn't mean that I couldn't learn to do it just as fast on the TS, but, hey I have it so I might as well use it.

Ralph Allen Jones said:

Good Morning Friend,
There is no need to admire us for all you need to do is to really give your table saw a tune up and to do this is to forget the gauge under the table that says the saw is set on "0" for the little finger that indicates the saw to be on "0" can be off ever so slightly. When I return my saw blade from an angle cut I use my combination square and set it so I am looking at a true 90º and I rest the body on the table top and slide the square to the blade in between the teeth and adjust the saw till I se no light between the saw blade and the square. Then and only then do I consider the saw to be set on a true 90º.

Respectfully,

Ralph

The American Woodworker said:

Hey Fellows,

As I always say, to each his own and if a fellow feels more comfortable using the jointer that is fine but, I hate to work that hard (grin). I hope I don't upset anyone but, a jointer is the tool of choice but the joiner is the fellow doing the work as per my glossary. Hence the Carpenters and Joiners Union.

Respectfully,

Ralph

aJohn Moody said:

I do check it with the square, but I use my Wixey to set my blade to 0. I do use my joiner almost daily, but when I am making cutting boards, I square on edge and face on the joiner and after running it through the planer I cut all of the pieces on the table saw that I edge glue. I like the Freud 40 tooth blade for this also.

I agree with you Ralph that you can't depend on the little arrow on the saw to make sure it is at zero.

I like knowing I can rip those pieces on glue them up and have a good edge, but I am also not ready to completely let my joiner go. It doesn't take but a minute to straighten an edge and a face. Doesn't mean that I couldn't learn to do it just as fast on the TS, but, hey I have it so I might as well use it.

Ralph Allen Jones said:

As I used to say when I was working in Columbus when a fellow asked me how many men are you working? My comment was, " three groups." How can you have three groups?" he questioned. My answer was one crew on the job, one going and one coming for it took three crews to get five good working fellows for a crew.

Ralph

The American Woodworker said:

Hey Ralph, you go through helpers like I go through socks!

That's funny Ralph.

Hey, that is why they make all of these tools so we can buy them and figure out what works best for each one.

No problem on this end. I just work the way that I understand it and I didn't get to be one of your apprentices. If I had, I bet I would be using a table saw to square up and straighten a board. LOL

That is what is so good about these forums. You can certainly learn the different ways everyone has in doing a job.

Ralph Allen Jones said:

As I used to say when I was working in Columbus when a fellow asked me how many men are you working? My comment was, " three groups." How can you have three groups?" he questioned. My answer was one crew on the job, one going and one coming for it took three crews to get five good working fellows for a crew.

Ralph

The American Woodworker said:

One thing I don't like about Wixey, it does not account for any discrepancy in the table saw throat plate. When you place a square to check the blade, you also check the sqareness of the plate. If your plate has saw dust under one side or even if your plate can bend slightly when you are holding down on it with a thin strip. Errors are not allowed when you want a perfect glue joint.

You are also correct Ron. Since I make my throat plates from wood I stick my Wixey to the table top first and then to the blade. I can then either use the Wixey or a level to make sure the throat plate is sitting correct. If not, I can adjust the adjustment screws on the bottom to get it flat.

And as I said before, I put the square up against the blade, across the throat plate to check all of it.

It takes all of it to make sure the cut is square and true.

Ron Altier said:

One thing I don't like about Wixey, it does not account for any discrepancy in the table saw throat plate. When you place a square to check the blade, you also check the sqareness of the plate. If your plate has saw dust under one side or even if your plate can bend slightly when you are holding down on it with a thin strip. Errors are not allowed when you want a perfect glue joint.