I was watching Antiques Roadshow a few minutes ago, and I saw a Federal style Cellerate or basically a portable bar, that was made in the mid 18th century and came from the southern plantations. It was valued at 30 to 50 thousand dollars. It was unsigned, no makers mark.

And then I started wondering, what will our fine woodworking be worth in a couple hundred years if it makes it that far. And what makes it valuable. I have seen pieces not valued high at all, just because it is old, doesn't make it valuable.

Let's take away the variables such as maker, rarity, and concentrate on craftsmanship and condition and style.

The federal piece I saw on the Roadshow, was common, the design, the inlay. It was a popular style during the time. So you could say the maker copied the original federal design with its inlays.

It's hard these days to make anything original, unless your an artist with an original flair to your designs. It seems like most furnishings have been made already, so any ground breaking design is rare in today's woodworking world. Yes I know there are very unique pieces out there, sideboards, chest on chest and chairs and etc that are very unique with there inlays and curves. But, the fact remains, components of even the most original and unique designs have been copied from works before it.

So, back to my question, can a Chippendale Highboy made by one of us today, have great value in a hundred or two hundred years from now? In that particular example, it is a common design, still duplicated by furniture makers today, it is a copy of the original made two hundred years ago or longer.

Or, in order for our work to have incredible value, does it have to be an original design and concept. Unique, and quite possibly a one off.

When an antique dealer is appraising one of my rocking chairs a hundred or two hundred years from now, I can almost hear the discussion. "well you know, this particular chair was made during a time when it was quiet popular to duplicate the design of the famous Sam Maloof, Mr Maloof started the whole Danish Modern craze in the 60's and 70's and many woodworkers strive'd to make furnishings similar to his, his chairs became almost cliche in the late 20th and early 21'st centuries, there were literally tens of thousands of these chairs made, and this particular chair is just one of thousands that saturated the market during that time" and then the appraiser commences to tell the owner that the chair is not really that valuable. Or, is it?

What would make that chair valuable? As in my example above with the Federal style Cellerate, the Federal style was most common, in essence, all the masters were copying each other, yet their furnishings today, can fetch hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Just musing,

 

 

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John Morris
The Patriot Woodworker

Good Morning John,

I have to agree with Charles on this matter for when we look at a piece of furniture no matter what style it is  and we say,"look at the figure in this piece," and count the time the craftsman must have taken to arrange the grain and figures to stand out and some what match as if they grew that way is an extremely handsome piece, is well worth the high dollar it may bring.

There are many factors that play into the value of the piece. If it was a federal piece, the quality of the piece reproduced would be a factor. Attention to detail, wood selection and condition of the piece 100 or 200 years from now. Did it with stand the test of time. Things that play into and reduce the value of an older piece is if it has been refinished. So the finish on the piece needs to be able to last just as well as the piece itself.

 

As you said it was a copied piece. I am sure their were many Highboys built that were made by difference craftsmen. All of them didn't come from the same shop. So I think it has a lot to with the quality of the piece.

 

Things that can help the price of a piece is the documentation. A sign piece and a picture of the craftsman with the piece help to give it authentication. If it was custom built for someone, having that person in the picture with the piece give the piece proper dating and authentication.

 

Just my thoughts on it.

 

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John Moody
John Moody Woodworks
http://www.johnmoodywoodworks.com

But back to my original question folks, what do you think our fine woodworking will be worth in a couple hundred years and why?

The Federal piece was a straight grain black walnut design, no fancy figure, unsigned, the original finish was still there, as a matter of fact the top of the case had burn marks from a time when someone set hot pans on top of it. The appraiser stated the piece was done by a fine craftsman. He did concentrate though on the area that it came out of, a southern plantation. So, maybe the historical reference holds a ton of value. Most likely a slave owner?

But if I could, I would like to hear you all declare why your woodworking will hold value and increase over time. What makes something we build today, highly valuable two century's from now?

 

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John Morris
The Patriot Woodworker

Well hopefully it will be the same things that make those pieces. The attention to detail. Like on your rocker, the attention to the detail around all of the joints. The joinery used will be a strong joint that should stand the test of time. Finishes that you use, if applied correctly will give the piece a finish that will last over the span of time.

 

Then the element we can not control is the environment that piece is housed in. Did the owner treat it as a treasure or just another piece of throw away furniture.

 

There are many pieces on here that I have seen that would certainly have that type of value. The bottom chest Bob posted this week is a piece that will stand the test of time. Your rocker is another piece that will be there in the years to come.

 

Wood selection, joinery, details, finish. Those are the things that will make the pieces we build be worth it in years to come.

 

 

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John Moody
John Moody Woodworks
http://www.johnmoodywoodworks.com

Great points John. I think you hit on something, if it can stand the test of time, and holds it's original finish, the value is there. Also I can throw in, design, is it a sought after design? This would bring more value to it. And I would like to go even deeper, how about our sociological circumstances during the time the piece was made. For example, furnishings made around the mid 18th century is highly sought after for it's inference of being made during our Revolutionary period, the birth of our nation. Could it be that furnishings made today, could have a similar title? We are in tough economic times these days, and garage craftsman have popped up all over the country in the last few years, trying to make an extra buck to put food on the table for the family. Could it be that our furnishings we make during this decade could be known as "Hardship Furniture"? We already call some furnishings made in the 30's as depression era furniture. There is a big market for rustic furnishings that were made during the Dust Bowl times, made by hand from a farmer in Oklahoma for his wife, it is beat, rustic, made from his local trees, milk paint remnants on it, that piece would bring a very handsome price today in the right market. As you stated, there are so many variables. The one variable I would like to leave out of this topic is makers mark, or manufacturer. As most of us probably don't sign our work, stamp it or whatever. Unless your a Bob Kloes with his incredible reproductions. But Bob is working on a relatively grand professional scale compared to most on here. 

Like that obscure farmer I referenced above, no mark, he built it on a whim, he wanted to make his wife happy is all, her birthday or what have you. He never expected it to last 8 decades, but it did. And now it is at auction for 2500 bucks. But because of the region, and the sociological implications of the time period it was made, make it valuable and highly collectible.


John Moody said:

Well hopefully it will be the same things that make those pieces. The attention to detail. Like on your rocker, the attention to the detail around all of the joints. The joinery used will be a strong joint that should stand the test of time. Finishes that you use, if applied correctly will give the piece a finish that will last over the span of time.

 

Then the element we can not control is the environment that piece is housed in. Did the owner treat it as a treasure or just another piece of throw away furniture.

 

There are many pieces on here that I have seen that would certainly have that type of value. The bottom chest Bob posted this week is a piece that will stand the test of time. Your rocker is another piece that will be there in the years to come.

 

Wood selection, joinery, details, finish. Those are the things that will make the pieces we build be worth it in years to come.

 

 

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John Moody
John Moody Woodworks
http://www.johnmoodywoodworks.com

 

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John Morris
The Patriot Woodworker

Just bumpin to the top for more commentary if you all so desire.

 

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John Morris
The Patriot Woodworker

Good Evening Fellows,

I have found a way to make even a new table look like an antique as told to me by one of my friends and clients.

The secret is two coats of gloss finish and one coat of Satin Pratt and Lambert varnish cut 50/50 with mineral spirits.

 

Try it out on a mock piece or just on a spare board and you will find the same as I did. The finish will look over 100 years old.

Hello John,

Don't faint but I'm back in the saddle to be here when ever needed along with my quizzes.

Now in regard to your post I feel that to duplicate another man's/woman's artistic design is a form of flattery towards that person and it would please me if someone were to duplicate a piece of my furniture. It matters not that the piece might be Arts and Crafts, Victorian, Queen Anne or what ever the style may be, we are honoring the persons who originally made the style.

If Someone were to duplicate one of my pieces I would be flattered and pleased and even when I make a second piece it will in some way be a little different for everything we might make will forever be a one of a kind because, no one can duplicate every piece exactly the same as the one before. They will be similar in style but not an exact duplicate.

Welcome back Ralph! How is the misses???


Ralph Allen Jones said:

Hello John,

Don't faint but I'm back in the saddle to be here when ever needed along with my quizzes.

Now in regard to your post I feel that to duplicate another man's/woman's artistic design is a form of flattery towards that person and it would please me if someone were to duplicate a piece of my furniture. It matters not that the piece might be Arts and Crafts, Victorian, Queen Anne or what ever the style may be, we are honoring the persons who originally made the style.

If Someone were to duplicate one of my pieces I would be flattered and pleased and even when I make a second piece it will in some way be a little different for everything we might make will forever be a one of a kind because, no one can duplicate every piece exactly the same as the one before. They will be similar in style but not an exact duplicate.

 

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John Morris
The Patriot Woodworker