June 24, 201214 yr I'm not sure if all newbies had the same concerns as I did, but when I was looking for my first table saw, I ended up buying a new, all be it lower quality, entry level saw with a riving knife and anti kickback paws over something older and used without either of these safety nets.  I'm sure glad I had both because I did some pretty stupid, unsafe, cuts starting out. Now though, with a little experience under my belt (six whole months), I find that half the time, I remove both safety features from my saw to do the job.I'm wondering though what those more knowledgeable than me think. As a rookie, the most desirable saw I could have would be a SawStop. I'm willing to admit though that my choice is driven both by reviews but more so because my tools still scare me a little. I know now that a safety feature, by itself, isn't likely to save me from getting hurt. It doesn't hurt though, right?I'm drawn in by the romance of restoring an old tool, but the lack of safety features scares me a little. Ok, maybe a lot. And don't say "Look for a used newer tool on craigslist." There's NOTHING out there in SoCal. I looked for months. I really mean nothing. The saws I went to go check out were sitting is someone's backyard for years or had been abused as workbenches, etc. The pitting or bows in the tops were off the wall.Where do you land on this? I'm ready for an upgrade now, but finances won't allow it for another 6 to 12 months. I'm eyeing the Griz G0715P at this point, but am still drawn to restoring an older saw.Where do you land?
June 24, 201214 yr Bob, My brother has a new Jet and its a great saw. Just recently I went shoping via auction for a tablesaw. The old Craftsman was due for an upgrade. I ended up snaging a 1947 Delta Uni-Saw in mint condition. After new belts and an arbor bearing change (my choice), I love the saw. Age means nothing on these guys. I fired it up with a nickle standing on edge on the table and the nickle never moved. If you can find one, an older Uni-Saw or Powermatic will make your life easier. As for the safeties, mine has none. Good luck in your search.Ron DudelstonSite HostAbove and Beyond WoodWorks
June 24, 201214 yr Hang in there Buddy!!!!!With business being the way it is you need to broaden your scope a little. Start looking at liquidations, auctions and estate sales, foreclosures, school machinery, and ANY bankruptcy liquidations, and government seized. There's a saw out there with your name on it. You may have to travel, look, hem, haw, finagle, wheezle, and beat the pavement but it's out there for the finding. While I wouldn't mind owning a sawstop I got my eyes set on a old northfeild with a 14 inch blade. And don't ever settle for anything less, cause you'll kick yourself in the morning. I've had the opportunity to pick up some really great pieces of machinery at next to nothing and some I would love to just sit and stare at like the bandsaw that a member just reconditioned or the pedal powered scrollsaw that is a work of art in itself. Others I wouldn't give you 50 cents for it. Everybody has gone through this at one phase of their woodworking or another so I'll tell you what I did. Pick brains. LOL, no don't become a zombie!!! Find a guy like I did (my freind Dana Hagstrom) who's father was in the business and he has been all his life and pick his brains. I do small work for him, assembly, cleanup, little stuff (and some big) and ask questions when time permits. The man is very knowledgable about machinery, what works, what DOESN'T and everything from A to Z about wood stuff. I pick his brains at just about every opportunity,, watch him like a hawk, and learn, learn, learn. "You'll never get better playing against a player you can beat all the time, sooner or later HE will be better than you" Step up a grade or three and you'll see that there's things out there you didn't even realize. Start bleeding the internet dry for info, send emails, ask questions, visit shops, call first and ask, talk to the owner, bring coffee for everyone and a box of donuts and for a 20 dollar bill you will have a hour long education that would have cost you hundreds at a "school". And you'll make some friends, some the same, some higher, some lower than your level. I've had guys come in to my shop and just pick MY brain, lol. I could talk shop with them for hours!! By the way, the search is what makes the saw YOUR saw, not just buying a 20,000 dollar slider and calling yourself a "Pro". I can make a full kitchen on a ridgid portable saw or a 20,000 dolllar slider (done both, lol). It's the journey that makes the end worthwhile, not the speed, or the time, or the ease. Anyone can, with enough money, fly to anywhere in the world, to mighty rivers, mountaintops, deep jungles, the seven wonders of the world. I wanna talk to the guy who walked there, sailed a boat there, climbed there, backpacked there. He's got the better stories.Â
June 24, 201214 yr I wish I were in your shoes!I'd travel a long ways to get an old General, Unisaw, Powermatic, or something similar. A few bucks and and some loving time in restoration would be a lot of fun and a great education. And Dragon's suggestions to get out and pick some brains is an excellent one. You might even find a deal on a great old piece of iron in the process. As to safety features.....a properly aligned table saw with SHARP, good quality blades is the best safety feature there is. Well, focused attention at ALL times can't be dismissed, either.I took the guard and pawls off my saw many years ago. I've been nicked a couple times, but it was due to stupidity and inattention, not the lack of a guard.Gene'The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him.' G. K. Chesterton
June 24, 201214 yr Bob, It all depends on what exactly you want. I myself got tired of the half plastic crud out there, and can't afford the new high end equipment. So I watch Craigslist, Ebay, rummage sales etc. With Ebay watch for the local pick up onlys that are in your area. The prices usually don't get bid up as bad due to the fact you've got to go get it. As far as safety features the machines are only as safe as the operator. Would you go driving blind folded? Alot of my machines date from the 1930's- 1950's And have all needed work to get them working properly. I enjoy working on them. I usually get the machines that others would consider parts machines. Why? I can get them for very cheap. Some of them are easy to find parts for others not so easy. I've even adapted parts from later model machines and had to make parts. It's part of the fun of the old machinery. Besides in my opinion there is a sense of pride in using a machine that you have redone. That and I like the looks of the old machines versus the new half plastic things of today. I only go after the smaller machines because of my shops size. And have even had machines shipped half way accross the country. Sure it adds to the cost, but if the machine is not that big the shipping cost isn't that bad. The old Delta 10" bandsaw I'm redoing was shipped from California to me here in S.E. Wisconsin for about what it would cost me to drive to either Chicago or Milwaukee. Ron, Gene, and Dragon1 have all given good advice. So I won't go further in that respect, it as I said all depends on what you want. Don't dismiss a machine because it has some rust, that can be cleaned up, bearings can be replaced etc. Look to see how complete the machine is as far as parts missing etc. You just may find a diamond in the rough for a decent price.  Larry Old Woodworking Machinery Forum Host Â
June 24, 201214 yr Bob,I don't want to step on any of the "Old Power Tool" guys toes, but for a table saw I would only go new(er) with the added safety features of a spreader or riving knife with the anti-kickback prawls everyday and twice on Sunday. I have a Jet Contractor with 52" table and cast iron wings. I added in a Beismeyer snap-in splitter with anti-kickback prawls and have been using it for the past 11 years. Some power tools I would consider going with older ones and doing the refurbishing, but not a table saw. That is just me and my opinion. If you go with Grizzly, you won't be disappointed as they make good stuff. If I was in the market for a new table saw, I would be looking very hard at the Grizzly cabinet saws as they make good stuff and cost considerably less than comparable Delta/Jet/Powermatic/Sawstop.Being that I am just down the road from you in Corona, CA, I hear you about the limited amount of decent larger power tools available on Craig's List, especially for table saws. The ones that you do find on CL would require so much time to restore as well as the cost of replacement parts, it would be more cost efficient to buy new.By the way, welcome to TPW! Give me a holler some time and maybe we could get together and have some lunch or talk shop since we are not too far away.Allen WorshamCorona, CAallenworsham@earthlink.nethttp://www.awcreationsandwoodcrafts.com'Graze in every man's field, but always give your own milk' J. Vernon McGee
June 24, 201214 yr Allen, Your not stepping on my toes, but I have a splitter with the anti-kickback pawls, and the overblade guard for my old Delta 1160 tilting table table saw ( table tilts not the blade ). They were an option and did not come with the saws back in the late 1930's. I've also got the hold-down assembly like a shapers that you use when running a moulding head on the table saw. So in most cases guards were available for most of the older machines, but were an accessory that had to be purchased as such. But as with anything else idiocy or carelessness will get you hurt. A little knowledge goes a long way. An added bonus is the fact if you do a little research and pick the right machines you will find that some of the accessories can be used on more than one machine. Such as both my table saw and radial arm saw share common accessories such as the moulding head, and with a differant moulding head ( which I have ) I can also use the same cutting knives on my shaper. Sure the accessories are getting harder to find but are out there. I forgot to mention estate sales as a good source of finding older machines, in alot of cases the family members selling off their parents or grandparents things haven't got a clue as to what it is, or what it's worth. They simply want it gone so they don't have to deal with it. Â Larry
June 25, 201214 yr Don't forget pawn shops, in the past year and a half I have seen some incredible buys at the local ones. GregScroll Saw forum hosthttp://www.thesawdustfactoryga.com/
June 25, 201214 yr A friend saw this thread and sent me an email suggesting that you might want to check out:http://www.socalmachinery.comThey have a lot of stuff there with much of it coming out of commercial shops as well as old machines. You may find something there to fit your needs.Allen WorshamCorona, CAallenworsham@earthlink.nethttp://www.awcreationsandwoodcrafts.com'Graze in every man's field, but always give your own milk' J. Vernon McGee
June 25, 201214 yr Bob, I went from a new Rigid to a '87 model UniSaw. No guard or paws. Runs like a kitten and eats wood like a lion. I have seen some of the pieces posted on here with bad pitting and rust and would have passed on it. After seeing the magic these guys work on cast iron tops I am not sure I would feel the same way today. That said I might also consider a SawStop if I had the budget, but I sure do like the UniSaw I have and it was way less than the price of a SawStop.Safety is an ever constant thing in the shop. There are no real safety devices on a sharp chisel. You just have to make sure you use all of the proper tools and use them the way they are intended. Use push sticks and keep the tools aligned and with sharp blades. When in the shop, have your mind on what you are doing. If you can't stay focused, turn off the tools and watch TV.John MoodySite AdministratorJohn Moody Woodworkshttp://www.johnmoodywoodworks.com
June 25, 201214 yr Author Wow - looking over the equipment on that site sorta made me feel like I did when I was a kid and the new sears catalog would come out. Thanks again!Allen Worsham said:A friend saw this thread and sent me an email suggesting that you might want to check out:http://www.socalmachinery.comThey have a lot of stuff there with much of it coming out of commercial shops as well as old machines. You may find something there to fit your needs.Allen WorshamCorona, CAallenworsham@earthlink.nethttp://www.awcreationsandwoodcrafts.com'Graze in every man's field, but always give your own milk' J. Vernon McGee
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